Let Go Of The Primary Anger

I'm talking to both sides here in this post--yes, to the Obama supporters, and to the Hillary supporters as well.

Obama supporters, let go of the primary anger. It's not productive anymore. We are in the general election, folks. I live in Washington, D.C., and let me tell you, Hillary Clinton is working behind the scenes to get her people onboard with Barack Obama. She knows she's not going to be the Vice-President in the end even though she is being considered like other candidates, but she IS determined to help wherever she can.

She's holding a conference call today with her donors, asking them to donate to Obama since some of them are still on the fence. She has been calling her delegates, asking them to support Obama as the nominee.

The reason why you haven't seen or heard her is because she ran for 18 MONTHS straight in a hard-fought primary contest. I think she deserves whatever time she gets off, but she'll be back in the Senate next week. Also, she's not trying to steal Obama's limelight as the nominee because he needs all the media attention on the fight between him and John McCain.

You know I was one of the harshest critics of Hillary's campaign during the primary. I've let go of that primary anger. I don't make snide remarks about her anymore. I've moved on to the general election, but some people clearly haven't.

And to the Hillary supporters, thank you for supporting Barack Obama. It's what Hillary wants you to do, and I thank you for listening to her. Now, to some of the other Hillary supporters, please be aware that Hillary is doing everything she can to support Obama, and no, she is not going to be the nominee. No, there isn't going to be an override at the convention in Denver.

Hillary Clinton is a Democrat. Whenever she says something, she means it. When she says she's a fighter, she IS a fighter. When she says she supports Obama, she SUPPORTS Obama. I thank her for doing so, and I look forward to her working in the Senate and to becoming one of the great lions of the Senate.

She and Obama both have become great icons as a result of this primary, and they will be interacting with each other on a constant basis. They once were a team of rivals, but they now are a team.

And Barack Obama has continued to recognize the great assets of Hillary Clinton in defending her against some that still hold onto their primary anger, like at the rally last night in Michigan:

Obama responded to some vocal Clinton critics in the crowd, who had reacted to praise for the senator from both the presumptive Democratic nominee and Michigan Gov. Jennifer Granholm, a longtime Clinton supporter.

"I want everybody here to be absolutely clear -- I want everybody here to be absolutely clear -- Senator Clinton is one of the finest public servants we have in American life today," said Obama, noting her work on behalf of children's rights and universal health care.

"She has been on the right side of just about every battle that we have fought -- she has, in her own words, shattered a glass ceiling into 18 million pieces. ....She is worthy of our respect, she is worthy of our honor.

"...And she's tough! That's why this race took so long. She's a fighter and we need fighters in the Democratic Party. Because we've got a lot to fight for. There's a lot worth fighting for."

Thank you, Senator Obama. Thank you, Senator Clinton. I look forward to you two working together in bringing McCain down, and helping elect more Democrats to Congress.



Display:


here's to the team! (2.00 / 24)

:-) Together, they're going to scare off the pants off the Republican Party.


by slinkerwink on Tue Jun 17, 2008 at 12:06:00 PM EST

Re: here's to the team! (1.83 / 6)

I agree. Some people around here can't get over the fact that the primary is OVER. Highly rec'd slink.


We want to see Ivana [Trump] because we are so desperate in Alaska for any semblance of glamour and culture. - Sarah Palin
by spacemanspiff on Tue Jun 17, 2008 at 12:09:40 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: here's to the team! (none / 0)

She knows she's not going to be the Vice-President

And you know this.... how?


by Xov Wonk on Tue Jun 17, 2008 at 06:07:06 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: here's to the team! (2.00 / 2)

spiff is a prime example LOL


by zerosumgame on Tue Jun 17, 2008 at 08:22:50 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: here's to the team! (1.00 / 2)

She's not a team player


It's time to restore balance and fairness to our economy,... It's time to stop giving tax cuts to corporations that ship jobs overseas... - Barack Obama
by Lefty Coaster on Wed Jun 18, 2008 at 11:06:33 AM EST
[ Parent ]

Fantastic diary. (2.00 / 5)

I feel like I used to see your work more often at dKos (though I could be mistaken). Very glad to see you posting more often here, too.


Even John McCain lusts after teh engels.
by sricki on Tue Jun 17, 2008 at 12:30:53 PM EST
[ Parent ]

I agree... (2.00 / 2)

This most certainly should be reposted at DKos, because there are many there who don't understand this simple fact there as well.


John McCain wants you to be poor!
by nklein on Tue Jun 17, 2008 at 07:01:10 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: I agree... (2.00 / 1)

and that includes Markos sadly


by zerosumgame on Tue Jun 17, 2008 at 08:23:25 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Here's the bottom line: (2.00 / 2)

The more Democrats in the House and the Senate coupled with an Obama Presidency -- the more power Hillary Clinton has to advance her causes (which are almost identical to Barack Obama's).

If there are 60+ Senate Democrats, she will likely get a seat on the Senate Finance Committee, where she will be able to work on health care reform.

So it's in our interest to elect Democrats at all levels of government.


by Brad G on Tue Jun 17, 2008 at 01:44:02 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Here's the bottom line: (none / 0)

yes a shadow presidency is healthy


by stevens7139 on Wed Jun 18, 2008 at 01:58:25 AM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Here's the bottom line: (none / 0)

For give a poor ole country hick but that was snark?


by 12 dogs and a blog on Wed Jun 18, 2008 at 10:36:00 AM EST
[ Parent ]

Whether it was or wasn't... (none / 0)

what did it mean?


Doubt is not a pleasant condition, but certainty is absurd. -Voltaire
by kydoc2 on Wed Jun 18, 2008 at 10:50:18 AM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Whether it was or wasn't... (none / 0)

Good question. I was wondering that myself. I too am interested in the posters definition and opinion on "shaddow governments".


by 12 dogs and a blog on Thu Jun 19, 2008 at 08:34:49 AM EST
[ Parent ]

Attention Obama Supporters (none / 0)

This is NOT cool.

DETROIT, Michigan (CNN) - Barack Obama defended Hillary Clinton at a Michigan unity rally Monday night that featured former Vice
President Al Gore -- and some off-message audience booing at the mention of the New York senator's name.

http://politicalticker.blogs.cnn.com/200 8/06/17/obama-defends-clinton-at-michiga n-rally


by Xov Wonk on Tue Jun 17, 2008 at 06:33:56 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Most definitely NOT cool... (2.00 / 1)

after Jennifer Granholm gives a stirring speech supporting Obama, Hillary gets booed.  That is not cool.


John McCain wants you to be poor!
by nklein on Tue Jun 17, 2008 at 07:04:20 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Attention Obama Supporters (2.00 / 1)

Jeez, maybe they picked that up from the rules and bylaws committee meeting


by stevens7139 on Wed Jun 18, 2008 at 01:59:45 AM EST
[ Parent ]

I REC'D YOUR DIARY (2.00 / 1)

but i hope you eventually realize how wrong you were about Hillary during the primary season.  YOu really were nasty towards her.


Hillary/Obama 2008
by Sandy1938 on Tue Jun 17, 2008 at 07:39:59 PM EST
[ Parent ]

I know. And I'm sorry for that. (2.00 / 1)


by slinkerwink on Tue Jun 17, 2008 at 08:03:41 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Oh well apology accepted.......... (none / 0)

even though I am not excited about Obama it will be great to have a DEM as president again.  Hopefully we can re-live the peace and prosperity of the 90's.  

Rec'd for your apology which seemed sincere.


Hillary/Obama 2008
by Sandy1938 on Wed Jun 18, 2008 at 12:12:56 AM EST
[ Parent ]

hope you learned something from the experience (none / 0)

It was incredibly short-sighted for the Obama-supporting community at DKos to indulge in all those Hillary-hate fests this spring.

A lot of people who don't even like Clinton (such as myself) lost respect for many, many people.

I was glad to see Obama call out the people who booed Hillary at his Detroit event. Sadly, his campaign did nothing to discourage the deranged Hillary-hate during the primaries.


John McCain: 100 years in Iraq "would be fine with me."
by desmoinesdem on Wed Jun 18, 2008 at 11:19:14 AM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: hope you learned something from the experience (none / 0)

But had Hillary won, it would have been harder for her to make inroads to Obama's supporters.  As a Canadian, sitting this election out, obviously, I have been an observer on the sidelines.  There was a lot of talk about Obama and Clinton surrogates dealing in dirty politics, but from my perspective, the invective was much stronger coming from the Clinton camp.

I was pretty angry about Clinton's ego during the campaign, but now that the Presidential campaign has begun, I've largely forgotten my anger and irritation - all is forgiven.  Check out No Quarter though, where the hate lives on.  


by bdbrown on Wed Jun 18, 2008 at 01:04:42 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: I REC'D YOUR DIARY (2.00 / 1)

It's true some Obama supporters were pretty  nasty during primary season.  I have discovered since Hillary lost that a few of her supporters are as nasty as I thought some of the Obama supporters were.   They are now supporting John McCain and they are leaving the Democratic party. I think we should stop being tolerant of their stupidity because it's already really old. If they want to support John McCain they need to be set straight.  He's going to pester them hard for all 200 of their votes because it will be the only votes he gets, except for those of his 150-year-old mother and his wax statue wife.

Both sides were nasty in the primary season, weren't they?  Fine -- I really just hope everyone can  face reality and keep John McCain OUT OF the White House. Instead of voting for him, for cripe's sake!!


by shellius on Wed Jun 18, 2008 at 09:10:10 AM EST
[ Parent ]

Somehow I am confident (2.00 / 4)

That it will take more than 4 recs for this to hit the wreck list. I'll give you the first.


Bush murders soldiers for profit. McCain wants to wet his beak.
by awobbly on Tue Jun 17, 2008 at 12:10:47 PM EST

Re: Somehow I am confident (2.00 / 4)

Including me makes seven.

Hmm. Not on the rec list.

To quote Condi Rice,

"no one could have predicted..."


should we go outside? / should we break some bread? / are you'nterested?
by Firewall on Tue Jun 17, 2008 at 12:13:57 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Somehow I am confident (1.50 / 2)

stock up on tin-foil, it's on aisle 11, we will send someone over to clean up after you again


by zerosumgame on Tue Jun 17, 2008 at 08:24:55 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Odd he hires a veep chief of staff (2.00 / 1)

before he knows who the veep is. You'd think he would let the veep pick a veep chief of staff.


by catfish2 on Tue Jun 17, 2008 at 12:13:00 PM EST

it's not odd at all (2.00 / 7)

as I recall, Bill Clinton did the same for Al Gore.


by slinkerwink on Tue Jun 17, 2008 at 12:14:54 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: it's not odd at all (1.66 / 3)

Score!


We want to see Ivana [Trump] because we are so desperate in Alaska for any semblance of glamour and culture. - Sarah Palin
by spacemanspiff on Tue Jun 17, 2008 at 12:17:40 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Before he knew who is veep was? (2.00 / 1)

I don't think so.


by catfish2 on Tue Jun 17, 2008 at 12:26:56 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Yes he did. It is standard practice (2.00 / 4)

John Kerry did it for John Edwards too.  It is to make sure that the VP stays on message.


by Delaware Dem on Tue Jun 17, 2008 at 12:42:32 PM EST
[ Parent ]

ZING!!!! (1.66 / 3)


We want to see Ivana [Trump] because we are so desperate in Alaska for any semblance of glamour and culture. - Sarah Palin
by spacemanspiff on Tue Jun 17, 2008 at 12:44:48 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: ZING!!!! (1.50 / 2)

you really just love to hold that anger and make everyone around you suffer don't you? sad to be you.


by zerosumgame on Tue Jun 17, 2008 at 08:26:03 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Why did Gergen, Candy Crowley, Borger (1.00 / 0)

say it was a bad move by Obama then?

Kerry hired Edwards' chief of staff? Well if you have a link that would be great.


by catfish2 on Tue Jun 17, 2008 at 12:47:47 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Why did Gergen, Candy Crowley, Borger (none / 0)

So you now think it has precedent it is just a bad move?  


Consider that everything which happens, happens justly, and if thou observest carefully, thou wilt find it to be so. -Marcus Aurelius
by Blue Neponset on Tue Jun 17, 2008 at 12:51:52 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Why did Gergen, Candy Crowley, Borger (2.00 / 1)

the "precedent" has been asserted but when asked for a link of any kind you and delaware dem just start flinging insults. got anything but bullshit?


by zerosumgame on Tue Jun 17, 2008 at 08:29:46 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Why did Gergen, Candy Crowley, Borger (2.00 / 1)

A quick google search turns up several articles from 2004: ?here is a link to an article from July 2004, discussing Kerry's VP staff and making guesses over who would be Kerry's VP choice. Kerry's VP chief of staff is not specifically mentioned in this article, but it is clear that Kerry picked VP staff before he picked a VP.

Here is another article, which specifies that Kerry had a Chief of staff before he picked his VP.


[The article is discussing who Kerry might pick for VP...]

The Democratic presidential hopeful's campaign has asked at least three Democrats on his short list for the job of vice president for detailed contact information and told each to be ready "as early as Tuesday" to join the senator from Massachusetts for campaign events and a fund-raiser next Thursday or Friday, the source said.

....

The Kerry campaign has a staff of 12 to 15 people ready to work for a running mate, including a chief of staff and communications director, Democratic sources said.


by letterc on Wed Jun 18, 2008 at 02:49:59 AM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Why did Gergen, Candy Crowley, Borger (2.00 / 2)

Ha ha ha!

Oooh, Gergen, Crowley, and Borger didn't like it!

Such progressives all. They'd slime the Dem. candidate no matter what he did, just like you would, catfish.


by JoeW on Tue Jun 17, 2008 at 12:52:29 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Check Politico (2.00 / 2)

And you want me to refute those pundits' opinion?  LOL.  Apologize for your heinous comparison of Clinton's loss to the Iraq War first.


by Delaware Dem on Tue Jun 17, 2008 at 12:52:58 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Checked it. (2.00 / 1)

It's not odd they hired Solis-Doyle. It's odd they put her in that specific position.


by catfish2 on Tue Jun 17, 2008 at 01:09:53 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Checked it. (1.50 / 2)

What position would you find less odd?  What can Barack Obama do for you? Be specific.

And check to make sure they aren't already taken.


We should be able to deliver bottled hot water to dehydrated babies.
by Jess81 on Tue Jun 17, 2008 at 03:15:49 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Check Politico (2.00 / 1)

actually she asked for a link to your assertions, not to care about pundits. if you cannot back-up up what you said why don't you just admit it and move on?


by zerosumgame on Tue Jun 17, 2008 at 08:28:15 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Your apology is in my pants. (none / 0)


by Dumbo on Tue Jun 17, 2008 at 08:55:10 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Why did Gergen, Candy Crowley, Borger (none / 0)

David Gergen is the biggest concern troll advising Democrats around.


by Khun David on Wed Jun 18, 2008 at 10:54:18 AM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Before he knew who is veep was? (none / 0)

Catfish2 = Fail.

Again.


by Rationalisto on Tue Jun 17, 2008 at 07:38:58 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Before he knew who is veep was? (2.00 / 1)

failed to get a coherent answer to her question, yes. but that is the failure of the ones making unproven assertions and then just insulting people when they ask for evidence.


by zerosumgame on Tue Jun 17, 2008 at 08:33:40 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Before he knew who is veep was? (none / 0)

Al Gore's campaign manager in 1992 was one of Clinton's senior advisors, which supports the idea that presidential candidate's choose their VP's staff. However, a search of the NY Times turns up no mention of Al Gore's VP campaign manager in 1992, so I can't say one way or the other on that. I also couldn't find a specification in the 1992 NY Times archives of when Gore's campaign manager was selected.

Are you merely doubting the claim, or can you refute it?


by letterc on Wed Jun 18, 2008 at 03:11:46 AM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Before he knew who is veep was? (none / 0)

Gore didn't run in 1992. He ran in 1988.

So, that is why you can't find anything about it.


by colebiancardi on Wed Jun 18, 2008 at 09:31:28 AM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Before he knew who is veep was? (none / 0)

I don't think you are understanding the question.

Did Clinton pick the chief of staff for his VP before he picked Gore for his VP? It doesn't matter that Gore wasn't a former competitor, the question is: do presidential candidates set up a VP candidate staff before they pick a VP?

I was searching for Clinton "vice president" "chief of staff" in 1992. The fact that Gore hadn't been a presidential candidate that year is irrelevant to that search.


by letterc on Thu Jun 19, 2008 at 02:55:13 AM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Let Go Of The Primary Anger (none / 0)

It will be a tough ask, if the Obama campaign makes more moves in the wrong direction as hiring patti..
it sent the wrong message at the wrong time.
by devil on Tue Jun 17, 2008 at 12:13:56 PM EST

why was that the wrong direction? (2.00 / 5)

Shouldn't Obama hiring Clinton staffers be a good thing? Patti Doyle-Solis is great for Latino outreach.

Clinton herself supported this decision:


"Patti will be an asset and good addition to the Obama campaign. After nearly two decades in political life, she brings with her the ability to tap an extensive network that will be a huge asset to Senator Obama. As Senator Clinton has said, we're all going to do our part to help elect Senator Obama as the next President of the United States," said spokesman Mo Elleithee.


by slinkerwink on Tue Jun 17, 2008 at 12:16:19 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: why was that the wrong direction? (none / 0)

No offense was intended, but it was taken, as seen in many reports today. If the Obama team did not expect it would happen that way, they probably did not think it through. (I think candy crowley in CNN said this, it's not an exact quote)


by devil on Tue Jun 17, 2008 at 01:07:44 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: why was that the wrong direction? (2.00 / 3)


No offense was intended, but it was taken, as seen in many reports today.

Bingo. Certain people are of the make-up that takes offense every time Obama breathes.

They've already decided they're going to be "anxious", "concerned", "offended", "outraged", regardless. This is simply the excuse du jour.


It is not because I cannot explain that you won't understand. It is because you won't understand that I cannot explain. - Elie Wiesel
by Sumo Vita on Tue Jun 17, 2008 at 01:48:08 PM EST
[ Parent ]

slinkerwink nails it. (none / 0)

Patti Doyle-Solis is great for Latino outreach.

In fact, let's make it a multiple-choice question.

Why did Obama hire Patti Solis-Doyle?

a. Obama wanted to pointlessly insult Hillary supporters.
b. Patti would be great for Latino outreach.
c. Pie.


by Dumbo on Tue Jun 17, 2008 at 08:58:29 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: slinkerwink can't nail it. (none / 0)

because he can't get over his anger.
Obama may be many things to many people and some of it not good but the one thing man isn't..is stupid. He would have to be stupid to intentially piss off the Clinton supporters at this point so no, that wasn't his reasoning for hiring Patti I don't think.
He is doing great with the Latino vote (reference Politico today) so I don't believe that is it.

She lives in Chicago and she has good experience in that capacity. He has Hillary's approval so I feel he felt it was a good move for his campaign.

While Mark Penn may have sold Patti out? The rest of Hillary's campaign staff loved her. He may have felt it was a good move for that reason.
She also did NOT sell Hillary out when she left though many in the MSM tried to get her to do so.

I agree that those who want a pacifier will be angry regardless of what Obama does at this point.


by Grissom1001 on Tue Jun 17, 2008 at 11:15:28 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: why was that the wrong direction? (none / 0)

Clinton didn't support it necessarily -- she fired Solis because Solis screwed up her campaign and wasted money. I have read they are barely on speaking terms. They are nearly enemies. That is why, it is said, Obama hired her. To send a message -- Hillary, it's not gonna be you.


by shellius on Wed Jun 18, 2008 at 09:15:06 AM EST
[ Parent ]

Clinton didn't have a problem with it... (2.00 / 2)

...so why do you?


In this avalanche, the pebbles get to vote.
by Dracomicron on Tue Jun 17, 2008 at 12:16:36 PM EST
[ Parent ]

So, he can't hire people if it will offend (1.28 / 7)

any Dead Enders amongst teh Clinton inner Circle?


by Geekesque on Tue Jun 17, 2008 at 12:21:31 PM EST
[ Parent ]

I gave you a 1 for the "deadenders" (2.00 / 5)

Can we please move away from these sort of insults? Like "Hillbots?" Like "Obamabots? Obamatons?" and so on?


by slinkerwink on Tue Jun 17, 2008 at 12:23:33 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Most Clinton supporters aren't (1.50 / 6)

Dead Enders.

Those that are acting like there's still a primary race on and trying to kneecap the party's nominee, are Dead Enders.  

To put it in perspective:

Atdleft and Linfar:  Not Dead Enders.

Alegre and the Pumateers:  Dead Enders.


by Geekesque on Tue Jun 17, 2008 at 12:53:11 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Most Clinton supporters aren't (2.00 / 4)

As distinct from arrogant clown Obamabots I suppose. I'm  a strong Hillary supporter but with him as the winner I have no problem with making the switch because I'm a democrat first. However, I do expect him to take all possible actions to win and I don't expect a lot of arrogant 'we don't need you' bs from folks this character. I'm going to vote for Obama but I find this sort of stuff deeply irksome so I can imagine the reaction amongst those who feel more strongly about it.


by ottovbvs on Tue Jun 17, 2008 at 01:28:21 PM EST
[ Parent ]

What 'stuff?' (1.60 / 5)

A couple of Clinton moneyraisers raise a ruckus, and this gets designated as a the worstest disrespect evah?

(Hint:  Maybe the people complaining are friends of Mark "Not My Fault" Penn)

Seriously, PSD's hiring is inside baseball stuff.  Obama thinks she'll do a good job.

I suspect HRC isn't terribly upset by this.  


by Geekesque on Tue Jun 17, 2008 at 01:31:23 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Still not a good term... (none / 0)

As a person who has been reprimanded for calling out the lies of some of the people you criticize as Deadenders, I still think it is an inappropriate term and obviously tr-worthy.  The most important focus for anyone concerned with electing Democrats (including Obama) is to stop insulting Democrats.  

The primaries are over.  We're a team now and we win and lose as a team.  Insulting other Democrats does not help in anyway and even if people louding grieve of loss of Hillary Clinton we shouldn't use that term to demonstrate their foolishness.  The reason being is that term was used for Clinton supporters as a whole towards the end of the primaries.  People who now fully support Obama were called that.  There's no need to use that anymore, even if it is descriptive of their behavior.


John McCain wants you to be poor!
by nklein on Tue Jun 17, 2008 at 07:20:40 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Uprated (none / 0)

for TR abuse


I'm only a click away
by juliewolf on Wed Jun 18, 2008 at 07:16:49 AM EST
[ Parent ]

Come up with your own phrase then. (2.00 / 1)

I'm becoming more and more inclined towards the simple, traditional word TROLL.

The nomination issue is over.  Now, all there are left or bullshit surrogate issues (like, is Olbermann a sexist, is PSD's hiring a fuck-you...) which are used as a way to continue the battle by other means.

At some point, I think it is misguided to try to change people's minds, because all you are really doing is feeding the trolls.  They don't all want to be reached out to.  Just recognize the fact that some of these people don't have good intentions.  

So, let's not use "dead-enders."  Fine.  Come up with some other one for us to describe these trolls.  


by Dumbo on Tue Jun 17, 2008 at 09:09:06 PM EST
[ Parent ]

WHAT THE REAL DEAL IS (none / 0)

Obama does not need the Hillary supporters that are there in La La land who refuse to support him....there is not a huge contingent of them..come on remember the thousands that were to show up at the DNC meeting? a couple of dozen showed..
The few that are still hanging on and ignoring Hillary? Cut them in half because half live in states that will go for McCain and now how many are left? Cut those in half because at least half won't show up to vote for McCain and that leaves how many?
Not enough to get upset over. Best to leave them alone to their anger and when they respond in an ugly manner just ignore.
I am certain that Hillary is not happy nor proud of their actions as she darn sure does not want to have to work the next 4 years under a McCain Presidency. If some want to work so that she has too? Then we know they were never true Hillary supporters to begin with.
by Grissom1001 on Tue Jun 17, 2008 at 11:22:03 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: So, he can't hire people if it will offend (2.00 / 1)

Will you QUIT with the Deadenders thing. I was and am an Obama supporter and I find it annoying.  Women who supported Clinton are moving to Obama, for heavens sake.  


by KateG on Tue Jun 17, 2008 at 12:32:26 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: So, he can't hire people if it will offend (2.00 / 0)

Then they're not referring to you- don't worry.  When I say dead-ender, that doesn't mean someone who voted for, or still loves, Hillary.  

A dead-ender is someone who is still under the misimpression that somehow, Clinton will come back and "save this sorry-ass party from itself" and magically claim the nomination.  Meaning they will continue driving down the road they were, despite the fact that it was, in fact, a dead end.


John McCain wants to stay in Iraq.
by ihaveseenenough on Tue Jun 17, 2008 at 12:49:27 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: So, he can't hire people if it will offend (2.00 / 1)

Seriously though, drop it.  People find it insulting.  People who are your friends and allies.  That should be enough?


We should be able to deliver bottled hot water to dehydrated babies.
by Jess81 on Tue Jun 17, 2008 at 03:18:03 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: So, he can't hire people if it will offend (2.00 / 0)

I'm sorry but if you're taking it as an insult, you're taking it incorrectly.  I speak for myself, of course, but "dead-ender" is neither directed at you nor anyone who is a friend and/or ally.

If it's that big of a deal I'll try and stow it, but really, you're taking it the wrong way.


John McCain wants to stay in Iraq.
by ihaveseenenough on Tue Jun 17, 2008 at 03:22:44 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: So, he can't hire people if it will offend (none / 0)

If it is any consolation - I think that it is a very useful term when used in its proper context.  just for kicks I visited hillaryis44 the other day and was astonished to see what was posted there.  Truly astonished.  Dead-enders is an absolutely perfect description of the folks who post that shit over there.  These people are out there - it helps to have an appropriate label for them.  the key is consistency in use of the term.  


by oliver cromwell on Tue Jun 17, 2008 at 05:15:56 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: So, he can't hire people if it will offend (none / 0)

Yeah- agreed.  Do you know what I call people who supported Hillary in the primary?  "People who voted for Hillary".  "Hillary Supporter" isn't a valid term- because I voted for Obama in the primary, but I am in fact a Hillary Supporter myself.  She's a Democrat, and a damn fine one, and regardless of what happened during a campaign, she still is.


John McCain wants to stay in Iraq.
by ihaveseenenough on Tue Jun 17, 2008 at 05:38:22 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: So, he can't hire people if it will offend (none / 0)

I like the phrase "deadender." Short, descriptive, and accurate.


by Rationalisto on Tue Jun 17, 2008 at 07:42:01 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: So, he can't hire people if it will offend (2.00 / 1)

Ooh. I hate that name!


It's time to restore balance and fairness to our economy,... It's time to stop giving tax cuts to corporations that ship jobs overseas... - Barack Obama
by Lefty Coaster on Tue Jun 17, 2008 at 10:32:58 PM EST
[ Parent ]

You know, not everything Obama does (2.00 / 1)

is done with a mind as to what Hillary or her most "vocal" supporters think about it.

He wanted to hire Patti.  So he hired her.  One thing about the Obama campaign that you should have learned by now is that they do not use their hires to piss people off, and they do not hire people they view as incompetent and not up to the task.

Thus, Obama must view Patti as competent and up to the job, and he wanted to have her in his campaign in some fashion.

You would think Hillary supporters would be pleased with this.  BUT NOOOOOOOOOO.


by Delaware Dem on Tue Jun 17, 2008 at 12:46:40 PM EST
[ Parent ]

please don't paint all Hillary supporters with (2.00 / 1)

a broad brush. You do us a disservice when you do that.


by slinkerwink on Tue Jun 17, 2008 at 12:58:57 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: please don't paint all Hillary supporters with (2.00 / 1)

Did you really think he meant every single Clinton supporter?  


Consider that everything which happens, happens justly, and if thou observest carefully, thou wilt find it to be so. -Marcus Aurelius
by Blue Neponset on Tue Jun 17, 2008 at 01:00:46 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: please don't paint all Hillary supporters with (none / 0)

Nope, just the Hillary supporters, which is why he said "Hillary supporters."


by SophieL on Tue Jun 17, 2008 at 01:25:04 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: please don't paint all Hillary supporters with (none / 0)

So you thought he meant all 18 million people that voted for Hillary?  

My take was that he was referring to the Clinton supporters who got upset about the hiring.  A small minority no doubt but I don't think they are easily confused with all Hillary supporters.  


Consider that everything which happens, happens justly, and if thou observest carefully, thou wilt find it to be so. -Marcus Aurelius
by Blue Neponset on Tue Jun 17, 2008 at 01:49:02 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: please don't paint all Hillary supporters with (2.00 / 1)

It would be really easy to type 'some Hillary supporters', almost as easy as typing 'Hillary supporters'.

One has a distinction, the other does not.  There's the rub for some.

Sorry.


Hell's bells, even the GOP didn't have to crucify Eisenhower's record in order to make Reagan their 'saint'. We can have two great ones, you know?
by emsprater on Tue Jun 17, 2008 at 02:05:08 PM EST
[ Parent ]

I think he meant to say (none / 0)

"dead-enders" rather than "the more vocal Hillary supporters," but was struggling for the right word.


by Dumbo on Tue Jun 17, 2008 at 09:12:04 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: You know, not everything Obama does (none / 0)

It's not good for Hillary because Hillary fired her. That's why it's not something Hillary supporters think is good. The women was incompetent when she worked for Hillary and she'll be incompetennt when she works for Obama. She made a lot of bad decisions and wasted a lot of Hillary's money on stupid stuff like snow shovels. I wonder if Obama knows how incompetent this person is.
 
by shellius on Wed Jun 18, 2008 at 09:25:01 AM EST
[ Parent ]

I was annoyed at the TV networks (2.00 / 3)

They cut away after Gore's speech... what the hell?  I would have liked to have heard Obama use the "18 million pieces" bit, because that's a Clinton line.  I'm liking the slogan sharing.


In this avalanche, the pebbles get to vote.
by Dracomicron on Tue Jun 17, 2008 at 12:14:58 PM EST

same here too (2.00 / 3)

I hate the news sometimes.


by slinkerwink on Tue Jun 17, 2008 at 12:17:10 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Same. (none / 0)

I was most displeased that they cut away like that.


Even John McCain lusts after teh engels.
by sricki on Tue Jun 17, 2008 at 12:33:58 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Let Go Of The Primary Anger (2.00 / 5)

Slinkerwink -

First diary made the rec' list.

Next I think we all need to get used to the fact that some folks just won't let go. For them anger and pot stirring is their happy place. Go figure.

For this group a I am making a concerted effort to just ignore and not rise to the bait.


Faced with the choice between changing one's mind and proving that there is no need to do so, almost everyone gets busy on the proof.
by jsfox on Tue Jun 17, 2008 at 12:26:48 PM EST

Clinton will not become a lion of the Senate (none / 0)

She's too old, and doesn't have enough seniority in that institution to get there.

I suspect that she will run again for President in 2012 or 2016 depending on the results this fall.

I do not expect that she will be on the ticket - I don't think that it is Obama's best pick, and I don't think that it's Clinton's best option either.  Not sure she serves in a cabinet position either, though Secretary of HHS could be of interest and a good fit.  My guess is that she serves another term in the Senate, focusing on the issues high on her agenda, then gears up to succeed Obama or Mccain.   If Obama wins the election, then she will likely have to face off against his VP (unless he wins in 2008 and is defeated in 2012).   But she will still have the support base, and money, to run a top tier campaign.  


by activatedbybush on Tue Jun 17, 2008 at 12:30:55 PM EST

believe it or not... (none / 0)

Clinton doesn't seem like much of a team player to me (just my impression, but it goes to her campaign and to her health care program). so if it's a cabinet post, why not Attorney General?


His head is bowed. He thinks of men and kings. Yea, when the sick world cries, how can he sleep?
by RisingTide on Tue Jun 17, 2008 at 01:30:39 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: believe it or not... (1.50 / 2)

Another twit working for party unity.


by ottovbvs on Tue Jun 17, 2008 at 01:32:18 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: believe it or not... (2.00 / 1)

Calling someone a "twit" isn't doing much for party unity.   Do only those who disagree with you have to be considerate?  


Consider that everything which happens, happens justly, and if thou observest carefully, thou wilt find it to be so. -Marcus Aurelius
by Blue Neponset on Tue Jun 17, 2008 at 01:39:50 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: believe it or not... (none / 0)

If it walks like a twit, talks like a twit, well you get the idea. I would say I'm a very typical democrat who supported Clinton but doesn't have any problems with Obama as the candidate although I think he's clearly got weaknesses that are going to need shoring up. So when Obama partisans start dissing Clinton by calling her a none team player when she has fully endorsed him and then says oh she could be AG like throwing a dog scraps from the table they are behaving like twits.    


by ottovbvs on Tue Jun 17, 2008 at 05:17:27 PM EST
[ Parent ]

blink. oh fuck you did not think I said that (none / 0)

I think we both owe each other an apology.

I meant that she didn't involve others in her policy shit.

Not that she wouldn't support Obama, for christ's sake!

I am embarrassed that something I wrote could be read so wrongly!

Take my apologies for the stupid internet mangling what i meant to say!

Attorney General would be dedicated to rooting out shitty republicans. Clinton sounds right on message to do that sort of thing, and to enjoy it!


His head is bowed. He thinks of men and kings. Yea, when the sick world cries, how can he sleep?
by RisingTide on Wed Jun 18, 2008 at 01:40:54 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Falsely accusing the former president and first (none / 0)

lady of race-bating isn't good for party unity. Neither is taking FL and MI off the table when would have had a HUGE impact on the race.

The only thing that will unite the party is puting Hillary on the ticket. Anything short of that is a waste of breathe.


by mmorang on Tue Jun 17, 2008 at 06:01:42 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Not going to happen. (none / 0)

The reason: Bill Clinton library.


by ReillyDiefenbach on Wed Jun 18, 2008 at 07:32:23 AM EST
[ Parent ]

According to Quinnipiac (none / 0)

far from being "the only thing that will unite the party," Hillary on the ticket actually "does not help dems." Also, their most recent poll shows Obama up over McCain in PA, OH,...and FL (same link).


Doubt is not a pleasant condition, but certainty is absurd. -Voltaire
by kydoc2 on Wed Jun 18, 2008 at 08:57:24 AM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: According to Quinnipiac (none / 0)

Obama was up big in CA the night before the election. He lost badly. It's happened in many other contests. His poll numbers are inflated because people don't want to be thought of as racists so they lie to the pollster.

The GOP till be airing ads showing the race-bating that went on in the Dem primary in an effort to win McCain some Hillary supporters. McCain will pick a younger and probably female VP. The GOP will have no problem turning Obama into a very polarizing figure.

The voter turnout among AA's and whites will be the highest in decades.

As soon as Obama makes it official that he's kicking Hillary to the curb McCAin will have his opening.


by mmorang on Wed Jun 18, 2008 at 03:29:20 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Clinton will not become a lion of the Senate (2.00 / 1)

Too Old??  

Hello - Ted Kennedy is considered the lion of the senate - I think he is a decade and half on Hillary.

And seniority doesn't mean just years - Reid doesn't have the years that Bryd or Kennedy - Reid became a senator in 1987.


by colebiancardi on Tue Jun 17, 2008 at 04:49:33 PM EST
[ Parent ]

suggestion (2.00 / 3)

I have been part of Wes Clark's site since he ran for prez. There are a lot of Hillary supporters there. It is a very loyal group.

I have not been there as much in the last few months,. I actually pulled back when I started supporting John Edwards, because I did not want to argue with my "friends".

So, if you would like, join up over there, read and lurk. Then when you have a grasp of the direction there, join in with positive thoughts. These people will work there asses off!

Here is the link:

http://securingamerica.com

http://securingamerica/ccn


Washington Woman
theocracywatch.org
EENR Blog
by kevin22262 on Tue Jun 17, 2008 at 12:31:53 PM EST

Re: suggestion (2.00 / 0)

Thanks for the link!  It's a good idea.

I won't sign up myself - temper and a tendency to insult people and all - but Wes Clark is a classy guy who's been a total mensch during this entire primary.  I would imagine he would attract similar people.


We should be able to deliver bottled hot water to dehydrated babies.
by Jess81 on Tue Jun 17, 2008 at 03:24:47 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Actually (none / 0)

I believe4 that most at SA/CCN are in support of Obama. They are VERY loyal to Wes Clark, so they were very loyal to Hillary Clinton and since Clinton and Clark have both come out for Obama, I notice that it is becoming a pro Democrat/Obama place.

One other thing, even tho the word "mensch" is a good word, it just feels like it should be an insult word.
http://dictionary.reference.com/browse/m ensch  

Just me... so no worries.  :)


Washington Woman
theocracywatch.org
EENR Blog
by kevin22262 on Tue Jun 17, 2008 at 11:30:53 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Actually (none / 0)

I believe that most at SA/CCN are in support of Obama. They are VERY loyal to Wes Clark, so they were very loyal to Hillary Clinton and since Clinton and Clark have both come out for Obama, I notice that it is becoming a pro Democrat/Obama place.

One other thing, even tho the word "mensch" is a good word, it just feels like it should be an insult word.
http://dictionary.reference.com/browse/m ensch  

Just me... so no worries.  :)


Washington Woman
theocracywatch.org
EENR Blog
by kevin22262 on Tue Jun 17, 2008 at 11:31:05 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Let Go Of The Primary Anger (2.00 / 4)

there is a new poster here who just continues to smear BC and Hillary and uses phrases and comments that come straight out the republican playbook from the 1990's.

I am glad to see that several mydd'ers have called this character on it.  But that type of crap has got to stop as well.  

Using republican ploys to smear the last 2 term democratic president in 50 years and his wife is fueling the anger


by colebiancardi on Tue Jun 17, 2008 at 12:32:12 PM EST

I think a lot of Obama supporters (2.00 / 2)

aren't yet aware that Bill Clinton is onboard with Hillary in supporting Obama:

Bill Clinton came to Hollywood for Thursday's American Film Institute gala to pay tribute to Warren Beatty, but the former President didn't miss the chance to play peacemaker among warring Democrats. While Clinton commiserated with Hillary-backers like Jack Nicholson, he also reached out to Obama-backers, like vicious Clinton-basher David Geffen. Said WJC to Beatty: "We all have to get behind Barack now."


by slinkerwink on Tue Jun 17, 2008 at 12:35:25 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: I think a lot of Obama supporters (none / 0)

no, I don't think it is that.  I think this person is a troll or ex-republican-turned-Obama-supporter only because s/he hates the Clintons.

seriously.  This person is disgusting.


by colebiancardi on Tue Jun 17, 2008 at 12:39:08 PM EST
[ Parent ]

that's sad. (2.00 / 1)

truly, truly sad. Obama is a wonderful candidate, and if the ONLY fucking reason someone supported him was to screw over Clinton... sad.

That said, I would be glad to see that person whatever party, vote in the Democratic primary.

It's an honest choice, between two options.

Ditto for the reverse in support of Hillary.


His head is bowed. He thinks of men and kings. Yea, when the sick world cries, how can he sleep?
by RisingTide on Tue Jun 17, 2008 at 01:33:12 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: I think a lot of Obama supporters (2.00 / 1)

There are plenty of Republicans and Indys posing as "Obama supporters" in order to continue their decades-long hatred for the Clintons. They'll undoubtedly vote for McCain, but in the meantime, they found that pretending to be Obama supporters provides a whole new audience for their Clinton hate-fest.

Whether you love the Clintons or not, all Democrats and real Obama supporters should recognize this phenomenon and understand that every time they believe or repeat Clinton-hatred, they are undermining the Democratic party and brand. This will only harm Obama and all Democrats running for election in November.


by LakersFan on Tue Jun 17, 2008 at 03:51:29 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: I think a lot of Obama supporters (1.20 / 5)

FYI- this memeber is a PUMA troll.


by DemsLandslide2008 on Tue Jun 17, 2008 at 04:48:25 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Let Go Of The Primary Anger (1.50 / 2)

There's one person who has been quite sucessful trashing the Clinton's with the Republican playbook. His name is Barack Obama.

In fact, he's been tougher on the Clinton's. His campaign convinced people that the Clinton's were race-bating.


by mmorang on Tue Jun 17, 2008 at 06:05:16 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Now, see... (none / 0)

I don't know what phrase to use to describe this kind of post and poster.  Dead-ender is frowned upon.  Yet TROLL seems insufficiently descriptive.

I wish those who TR-ed Geekesque would give us further advice on the correct jargon.


by Dumbo on Tue Jun 17, 2008 at 09:28:23 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Now, see... (2.00 / 1)

go with dead ender, its frowned upon, but you cant dress up a pig to be anything other then a pig. Anyone who watched the campaign new who the vastly more negative candidate was, the kitchen sink didn't bring home the nomination, and we are all better off for it.

There is a reason campaigns go nasty, and i think it says something about out progress that the negative campaigner lost, kind of makes me giddy inside.


"Is there no keeping with class in whom we mingle with anymore?"
by Brandon on Tue Jun 17, 2008 at 09:33:58 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Now, see... (2.00 / 1)

The problem with dead ender is that it assumes that the troll is anti-Obama because he isn't Clinton, rather than anti-Obama because the troll is a stone cold racist or some other sort of Republican.

If the troll has a long history as a pro-Clinton partisan, then the term dead ender might apply, but if the poster doesn't have a long history, they should be called a garden variety troll, even if they are using the "Obama was mean to Clinton" talking points.


by letterc on Wed Jun 18, 2008 at 03:40:11 AM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Now, see... (none / 0)

and maybe the "anti-Obama" poster has a long history of telling it like it is and that rubs you the wrong way.


by mmorang on Wed Jun 18, 2008 at 03:36:32 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Now, see... (none / 0)

Actually, I was speaking in the abstract. I know nothing of your history, and don't really give a damn if you enjoy speaking ill of Obama on minor poliblogs.


by letterc on Thu Jun 19, 2008 at 02:57:54 AM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Now, see... (none / 0)

You seem to have a problem with anyone who has a different opinion than you.

Are you not aware that Hillary supporters are furious about the way she was treated? You can disagree with them but you don't have to call them trolls....or what the heck, call them trolls and worse.

You're right, everyone who doesn't agree with you is evil.


by mmorang on Wed Jun 18, 2008 at 03:34:50 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Let Go Of The Primary Anger (2.00 / 1)

Brilliant. Exactly how I feel. I got furious with Hillary around March/April, but now I've moved from grudging respect to something approaching admiration, and understanding. I really do think, as I wrote in a diary way back, that she has taken over the Clinton brand and proved herself as the most formidable politician in the US (with one exception).

Some will see this change of tone as merely tactical. But it isn't. She's a politician and fought hard using everything available to her. My support was elsewhere, but I have no anger left towards her. I don't know where it went, but it's partly due to the grace of her departure from the race, and the grace of most of the (genuine) Hillary supporters on this site.


Pointing to the inadequacies of John McCain
by duende on Tue Jun 17, 2008 at 12:37:32 PM EST

Glad you feel that way (2.00 / 3)

Of course it's easier to be a gracious winner.   I personally liked Obama throughout the campaign (at least he was "likeable enough" LOL).   So never had any anger directed at him personally.  


by activatedbybush on